With the 20th anniversary of the space shuttle Challenger explosion next week, I talked with astronaut Mike Mullane on my show this afternoon. He’s a three-time shuttle mission specialist who has some harsh words for NASA in his book, “Riding Rockets.” He explained what was wrong with the culture inside the space agency after Challenger, and the Columbia disaster, and what he thinks still needs to be done.

We also talked the adventure of going into space, how he couldn’t sleep onboard because of the awesome view, the impact on astronauts’ families, and more. Another first-person story from someone who’s done something you and I never have.

Listen to our conversation here.